21. Todd Moore, ISB. Cargo Theft and What You Didn’t Know
Email address: email@example.com
Information for PULSE: https://www.isbglobalservices.com/services/cargo-loss-prevention-and-supply-chain-security/commercial-transportation-companies/
Todd Moore (0s):
Well, Chris lick to kind of talk about cargo theft and the critical crime problem in Canada, and maybe some secure logistics and some ideas for a Colonel loss prevention. That's light chain security. That was mr. Todd
Chris, Safety Dawg (15s):
From ISB. And he's my guest this week on the Dawg On-It Trucking Pawedcast. Welcome to the Dawg On-It Trucking Pawedcast. When it comes to trucking safety, the dog is on it. What do we do on this show? I get to talk to some of the most influential trucking executives in our industry so that we can pick up new tips and tricks to use in our everyday.
Todd Moore (48s):
Let's get on with the show. Hey Todd, welcome to the Dawg On-It Trucking Pawedcast. How the heck are you? Good, Chris. Thanks very much for having me very much. Appreciate it. It's my pleasure. Todd, can you tell us what makes you an expert in cargo loss prevention? In other words, what's your background? Well, currently Chris, and I'm a, I'm the vice president with ISB global services, which is a company out of Milton. And there I, I run the, I oversee the herbal theft and specialty risk division.
Todd Moore (1m 23s):
And that division is kind of focused on cargo theft mitigation prior to joining ISB global services. About 20 months ago, I, I was with the fuel regional police. That was a detective there for 31 years and, and retired back in 2018. And during my 31 years with peel, I was, it was involved in a number of different units, robbery unit, but the majority of my last 12 years of my career was spent in the intelligence unit where I, I was the detective in charge of the organized crime unit.
Todd Moore (1m 58s):
It was funny, although we did organize crime, every single or almost every major investigation had at, at a tangent to a cargo theft. And I became very intrigued and the whole cargo theft and that kind of seed money that helps fund other criminal activities. Another thing to address prior to while I was on the police department, I am for a number of years, 15, 16 years, I had my own robbery training business. And one of the things I got asked back in 2009, 2010, was to put together a robbery truck, hijacking course that was back then cigarettes computers were being, there's a number of different violent truck hijacking courses for a robbery incident.
Todd Moore (2m 43s):
So I put together a truck hijacking course. And then I think after that, I kind of got hooked on this a little while a cargo transport idea. Well, that's kind of cool. So your years as a police officer, then you were in intelligence
Chris, Safety Dawg (3m 1s):
And so you were exposed to some of the, I'm sorry. I think of it as being a cop. You know, if you're a street cop, you're just kind of exposed to everybody in the general public and things aren't too bad, but in, in intelligence, I would imagine you're exposed to some of the worst of humanity.
Todd Moore (3m 24s):
Well, yeah, the intelligence is a pretty unique unit, a lot of covert investigation. So basically what we do in a nutshell, Chris, is what we would do is we would work with confidential informants and police agents. And we would infiltrate certain organized crime groups and try to dismantle and disrupt them. So, and like I said, it's, it's most organized crime groups are in some way or fashion involved in cargo crimes though. It's a very, very interesting job, but it was, it was a real eyeopener to kind of peel back the onion and see what a real problem is.
Chris, Safety Dawg (4m 3s):
And I know with my years at old Republic insurance company, of course, that's, I think that's where we first met. Is that a symposium or something? When I was still there? How long have you been at ISB now?
Todd Moore (4m 17s):
Just under two years. Okay.
Chris, Safety Dawg (4m 20s):
I met you before, long before. Two years ago.
Todd Moore (4m 25s):
Yes. Yes. So I think prior, prior to coming over a number of different, yeah, we have met at different different trucking events and security events and yeah.
Chris, Safety Dawg (4m 37s):
Is obviously cargo theft is a, when I was with old Republic and now that I'm, you know, on my own cargo theft is still a big deal and well, where's the cargo theft capital of Canada,
Todd Moore (4m 53s):
All that's, that's a, that's a great question. That's a, unfortunately it's the greater Toronto area I'm working with specifically peel region and that's kind of the, the department that I spent my entire career with, but it's kind of funny if you look at cargo theft, Chris and I'm, I'm pretty, passionable that cargo theft and robbery. And if you look at Carlos theft on a global scale, it's, it's, it's a worldwide problem. You look at the numbers in Europe and different methods of operation, but a huge problem in Europe, huge problem in South Africa, highest rates are in Brazil and South America, Mexico.
Todd Moore (5m 32s):
Isn't so much, I like to call carbo crime in Mexico. It's not so much Carlos. Now it's more truck hijacking. And then you look into a U S and Canada. There's basically eight different hotspots. Those kind of hate eight hotspots of being kind of prevalent for the last decade. And it's Los Angeles, Dallas, it's Miami Lanta and New Jersey Chicago. And in Toronto, ironically, if you look at some of the statistics and I think you'll find this pretty interesting two years ago, Canada actually had more cargo thefts.
Todd Moore (6m 8s):
They had two 621 cargo thefts in 2018. And my comparison in the U S they have 591. And if you broke those numbers down on a 341 of those cargo fests took place in the immediate appeal. And that's just like, that's just absolutely mind boggling. Even the peel, the onion back a little further. If you look at the population appeal, it's 1.3 million. The next highest area in North America for cargo theft was California.
Todd Moore (6m 39s):
And they had 208 incidents. So you look at the population of California, they have 40 million people. So 40 million people compared to 1.3 million it's it's, it's a massive, massive problem, the greater Toronto area. And it's, it's something that's, it's one of those crimes that's been flying under the radar for a number of years in the pen. I'll be honest with you. I just think no, one's really taken ownership to kind of fix the problem. You know, the police are doing the best they can, but the problem is fixable. I just, I think somebody's going to pick up on right.
Chris, Safety Dawg (7m 11s):
It's certainly is fixable. Nobody's paying attention to it. I would agree with that statement. And of course, you know, we're doing this interview and politically right now, there's an awful lot of calls for defunding of the police, you know, and I don't want to go down and political thing, but right now, if nobody's paying attention to cargo crime and you alluded to it, but I want you to expand on it. You said that when you're in intelligence, that cargo crime helps feed other stuff.
Chris, Safety Dawg (7m 46s):
So why should we, the public care about cargo crime, nobody gets hurt when a tractor trailer is stolen with a load of diapers.
Todd Moore (7m 56s):
And that is the public perception. Chris, I think the public perception is they don't understand the scope of the problem. Number one, I think the public doesn't understand the ripple effect of what the problem is because eventually we all pay for those cargo thefts and the losses. And, and second, thirdly, I think the public just doesn't understand the, the criminal element that's involved. So yes, it is organized crime. So if I steal a load and I make up $130,000 off a stolen load of diapers or detergent, I turn around, I take that $330,000.
Todd Moore (8m 32s):
And now I invest that in importing he's of cocaine. And that commodity now has a, has a value of 10 times more than what the partial theft was. So it's, it's a moneymaking machine, organized crime groups can three, four, maybe five times money based on what the stolen commodity wise. And I'll be honest with you when you look at the numbers, they're mind boggling, but it's, it's a crime that's not going to go away because to your point, is it, is it a property crime people think of it as more of an insurance problem, but it's, it's highly re it's, it's low risk type of warning.
Todd Moore (9m 13s):
It's that's the term you always hear about cargo theft. And I'll be honest with you unless you have a horrendous criminal record because it's a property offense, probably not jail time. So it's kind of a win win for that.
Chris, Safety Dawg (9m 26s):
Yeah. And I mean, again, when I look at old, old Republic, when I worked there, nobody got punished when they, if they got caught for stealing a load, you know, as you said, risk reward, there's a lot of rewards, unfortunately.
Todd Moore (9m 42s):
And, and, and, and I think two fat, two dresses, you know, with our, with our laws to possession of stolen property, there's certain elements that the police have to prove. I have to prove that you've had control of that property. I have to prove that you've acknowledged that it was stolen. So there's a lot of factors, you know, willful blindness plays into it just to go back to your point about the funding, the police, and, and it's funny, cause right now, you know, if you look in the U S and how the U S numbers have actually decreased the last four or five years, Gilford, Jean has gone up by cargo fests have decreased.
Todd Moore (10m 16s):
And I think they've done a really, really good job. What was it? Eight hotspots that I talked about are in the seven hotspots in the U S over half of those have their own cargo theft taskforce. So they're local state, federal police agencies, all working together in conjunction with, in conjunction with the national insurance crime Bureau. That's gonna help me fund some of these projects. And what they're doing is they're disrupting this. Man's within these groups, they're, they're working them. They know which theft groups are active and crossing certain States.
Todd Moore (10m 48s):
And they've done a really good job tackling the problem. If you're looking at Canada, there's only two police agencies in Canada that actually have dedicated cargo fem units. And that would be peel region and in York region, a York regional police radar officers. But once again, because it's pro property crime, they don't have the budgets to run the sophisticated investigations. I've always laughed. I said, it's the public Dean's at all public, or a, sorry, a property offense, but it's, it's more of an organized crime problem.
Todd Moore (11m 23s):
And I think if you want to eradicate cargo theft, what I think the solution is from a policing perspective is you have kind of a joint force task force in the greater Toronto area, whether that's funded with the assistance of the insurance companies and what they do is they tackle certain groups. Cause there's not, there's not that many groups in the greater Toronto area with the groups that are involved very happy and greater Toronto areas is, is very unique. And I think our numbers are unique because we have a very unique landscape of criminal organized crime group.
Todd Moore (11m 55s):
So now we have your traditional organized crime groups. You're a time Lafayette. We have South Asian organized crime, you have Asian or Eastern European organization. And a lot of those groups are actively involved in carnal fence. So it's a, it's a it's I think it's a very geographically it's very
Chris, Safety Dawg (12m 15s):
Well. I think it's kind of cool in that, even in our crime areas, we welcome everybody. We have the mall.
Todd Moore (12m 23s):
Yes we do. And it's comedian. And when you kind of look at it and like I say, we go back. I mentioned coming from the insurance industry, people say, well, you know, something, it's, it's, it's an insurance problem. And I think a lot of people honestly believe that people are gonna sweat. Somebody stole some diapers, somebody stole a truck. What the tires who cares it's insurance, which kind of leaves right now, it's kind of up to the police to tackle the problem. And if you look at, from a police perspective, especially with everything that's going on now globally, you know, the police are our business as well.
Todd Moore (12m 59s):
They got a fixed budget. They have resource issues that they're trying to do more with less. They have investigative priorities. So if I'm every, everybody, every unit, you know, whether I'm in cyber crime or robbery or breaking enters, everybody, every unit thinks their investigations and the most important. So it gets very hard from a police perspective to get that attention to mine. I mean,
Chris, Safety Dawg (13m 27s):
Unfortunately the police budgets back, I mean, this is many years ago, probably 10 years ago,
Todd Moore (13m 33s):
Chris, Safety Dawg (13m 35s):
Around the claims department. We had a couple of loads of diapers stolen. It was two loads that was 10 years ago. That was $250,000 in cargo theft. And the carrier had really good cameras. It was done at night. And it was funny. I saw the video of, because the owner of the company invited me in and he turned it over to the claims department, of course, for the insurance company. But it was funny. They knew where the cameras were and the one fellow, his bandana fell off his face.
Chris, Safety Dawg (14m 8s):
And as it fell out,
Todd Moore (14m 9s):
He looked up the camera, pull it up
Chris, Safety Dawg (14m 13s):
The bandana. And the police, when they got that video said, no problem at all, this should be pretty easy. One to crack and weeks went by and weeks went by and the owner kept calling the police department. And this was in peel and the person who was in charge of identifying that person from the, the video kept saying, I'm sorry, I'm being pulled off because we had a more severe crime, a shooting or something. And they kept getting pulled off of this.
Chris, Safety Dawg (14m 43s):
As you call it property damage or property claim where nobody got hurt too much more serious situations, which I believe is the right thing to do. Because as much as people are saying, you know, defund the police, I think they're underfunded. Or at the very least, they don't put the funds where they're needed something like this, where we can catch a criminal. And they're likely, as you've said involved in other stuff already, why aren't we putting the resources into catching that criminal and taking them off the street?
Chris, Safety Dawg (15m 17s):
You know, I know that's not really a question for you, but it's just, it used to piss me off. Sorry.
Todd Moore (15m 24s):
And it's funny you say that Chris, because even now, you know, the two units in Canada that have dedicated cargo theft units are great investigators. It's an old school queasy working at formats, doing static surveillance, but because of the organized crime element, if you truly wanted to dismantle that it takes money in, unfortunately it takes money to catch bad guys, right? You have to, you know, you, you have to do wire taps and you know, people won't talk on the phones now there's, there's encrypted apps that you can talk back.
Todd Moore (15m 55s):
So you have to be very, very creative and it, it does it just cost money to, to eliminate crime. And I think as this problem is the numbers continue to go up. And you've seen since 2015 cargo theft rates triple, I don't see the numbers dropping significantly, not going up every year, because it's just, it's just way too profitable.
Chris, Safety Dawg (16m 17s):
It's way too profitable. And right now we're not willing to spend the money as taxpayers cause we don't see it generally. We don't see it as a big enough problem. That's my thing. So what can a trucking company do for instance, to mitigate their losses or do make their cargo harder to be attacked or to be stolen?
Todd Moore (16m 44s):
Well, it's funny. Cause I think the, I think the number one thing you can do, and I'll tell you a quick story. When I, when I was in, we seen, I, like I said, I dealt with some confidential sources and they had a source one time, it was entrenched in cargo theft. Then I asked a specific question. I said, if I was to deputize you, how would you and cargo theft and the sources he gets her, it was GPS, every trailer, all the bad guys know only the tractors or GPS, not the trailers.
Todd Moore (17m 15s):
And I thought about that for a second. I said, that's, that's, that's the mindset of the criminal. That's the criminal element thinking that. And I'll be honest with you, Chris, that is if we want to put the biggest dent in the cargo theft, that is the quickest solution is GPS the trailers. And I understand why they're not in, you know, from coming from the insurance world for every tractor, you probably have two to three, if not four trailers. So it becomes a cost factor where I think, you know, I, I think this is where the insurance comes in.
Todd Moore (17m 46s):
Insurance individual insurance companies can play a big part in this. There has to be some incentives on the insurance side of that house that motivates trucking companies to start GPS in their trailers. And whether that be some type of reduction in premiums. But I think by putting in tracking systems in the trailer, and the reason I say that is I took, here's a, here's kind of how a typical Cardinal theft happens. So say between Friday night and Monday morning, you know, a lot of times the, these groups will be working on either intelligence that's gathered.
Todd Moore (18m 26s):
So they they're specifically targeting a certain trailer or maybe they target a random truck yard. That's a, that's an industrial area. A lot of times they'll steal a tractor, bringing their own tractor and, and, and steal a trailer. So if that trailer is not GPS and that trailer leaves the yard, there's a very short window of opportunity to recover that. And even if it was GPS, there's still a short window of opportunity to get that information to the police that can have the police act in real time.
Todd Moore (18m 57s):
And unfortunately the majority of cargo thefts happened Friday night, the Monday morning. And that corresponds when the police are the busiest on the weekends, other priority calls, right? So I would say GPS in the trailers is, is past. And then secondly, having some type of mechanism that allows you to get that information to the police and mealtime and allow the police to live track in real time. And I think if you, if you talk to the insurance industry, their biggest pain point, number one is the low loss ratios in the small number of trailers that are actually recovered in real time.
Todd Moore (19m 34s):
Right? So I think that's, I think trucking companies, that's probably something that they could look at. I think the other big thing is target hardening your yards, making sure you have proper preventative security measures at your yard because that's the majority of lender happening to him, to your point, whether it's video cameras, proper lighting, proper seals and locks. So those are, those are preventative measures that you can do. The GPS tracking, I think is by far the test.
Chris, Safety Dawg (20m 1s):
So that's interesting because I mean, GPS tracking in, I don't know this as a fact, but I believe it's my belief that it has really been reduced in price re like over the last several years when GPS first came out, it was not inexpensive. And now it is inexpensive. I know one of my carriers that I'm working for, they, they don't tell their drivers, but every trailer is a GPS tracked everyone.
Chris, Safety Dawg (20m 32s):
Todd Moore (20m 32s):
Yep. Yup. And it's funny because I think over the years, the biggest problem, and especially in the climate we're in and in the greater Toronto areas, we get very harsh winters. And when it comes to GPS tracking battery is everything right? And, and think technology has advanced so much with GPS that, you know, you know, devices now can be, they can be hardwired, it can be wireless, they can be embedded in the trailer and concealed. So I think technology is advancing, making it easier for, for these devices to use.
Chris, Safety Dawg (21m 6s):
Yeah. And as you say, it's probably the easiest way. Now you mentioned about getting real time information to the police. So if I was to outfit my trailer fleet with GPS, how do I work it so that I can get that info to the police? Is there a mechanism now?
Todd Moore (21m 28s):
Well, that's a funny question, crystal. When I came over to ISB and I built our, our pulse, our loss prevention, supply chain security program, one of the things, so it was designed for two to three reasons actually to kind of assist insurance companies with reduce their cargo losses and claims and loss ratio kind of assist the police with a person to assist insurance or transportation companies with kind of a best in class security program. And the third was to provide police with the necessary tools that they need to do their job better and recover more load.
Todd Moore (22m 3s):
So right now, how it kind of how it kind of works. It is if, if there's a breach of the geo fence, you know, every geo, you know, there'll be a trucking company. Usually the fleet manager will get an alert. He'll get that alert. Be two o'clock on a Saturday morning, I pick it up. I see where the alert is. Say, it's my trailer's going down to four Oh one between Milton and I don't know wealth. Now I have to call and I have to figure out, is this all PP with this, be all this wealth is this Hamilton.
Todd Moore (22m 35s):
And I gotta, I gotta make those phone calls. So when we built our program, what we look and we have the luxury of having sister companies that are into crisis risk management. So we have two command centers, global command center. So we were able to do this. But what we did is we build a platform that allows us to integrate into any GPS system. And we take that information. And through our command center, we go through a notification validation process.
Todd Moore (23m 5s):
Number one, we want to make sure it's not user error and it's valid alert. And if it's a valid alert, we have a database of 37,000 law enforcement, nine one one call centers. And we are operators make a call to the police agency of jurisdiction. And then what we do is we send up all the asset details as well as a live tracking link to the police that is allowed them, allows them to forward that to the informed cars and in life track the level at time. So it was something that was completely missing from the market.
Todd Moore (23m 38s):
And I think it's what I said. There's such a small window of opportunity for load recovery, giving those that live tracking ability to the police. So now when that load goes into a warehouse and it's unloaded, the police can track that history. And you know, it's all about telling the story to a judge. They can get a search warrant so you can get that load back, right. Just like when you're in your claims days.
Chris, Safety Dawg (24m 3s):
Yeah. Well, no, I haven't. It's funny. I don't know if you saw the news. I believe it was just last night we recovered. I say we, the police recovered a load of PPE last night.
Todd Moore (24m 16s):
Yeah. Yeah. Can you handle something with everything that's going on right now? And yeah. You know, personal protection equipment is, is really high value, high risk because there's such a demand for it. It's funny. There's almost, if people always ask me what would get stolen. And I said, obviously, you know, there's a, there's a market for anything on the black market. You know, willful blindness. If somebody says, Hey, we'll quote, it fell off the truck. If I don't ask, I don't know. Right.
Todd Moore (24m 46s):
And everybody's looking for a deal. But if you look at, you know, you have your high risk commodities, like you mentioned, like PPE and other items like that, but you know, food and drink, you know, they're hard to trace. They don't have a serial number. And if I run a restaurant, if I run a grocery store, you know what I mean? It's, it's just, I can flip them on small devices, you know, small items like Gillette sensor, razors, or batteries. Those, those can be sold in any mom, pod, grocery store. It can be still.
Todd Moore (25m 17s):
And so, and construction materials, you know what I mean? There's with all the construction going on, everybody's looking for, you know, wood supplies, washer, and dryers. There's a market for anything
Chris, Safety Dawg (25m 31s):
Right now, just, you probably don't know, but my girlfriend is a dental hygienist. And so she owns her own practice and we've seen in 95 mass are, she can't buy them. They're $20 a piece at the moment for an end 95 mask. And they used to be, I think she told me two or $3 before this situation happened. And now they're at 20 because you can't get enough for them. And everybody's required.
Chris, Safety Dawg (26m 2s):
She's required to use five of them a day. You know? So yeah, that would be a commodity right now that could be sold quite easily. You know? So I mean, companies like hers, it's hard to recover those costs because it's, you know, your personal insurance companies paying it mostly. And so it's hard to bill extra because there's contracts involved in all kinds of stuff. So anyways, PPE is pretty cool.
Chris, Safety Dawg (26m 35s):
So we talked about what you mentioned, what they steal. You mentioned how we can harden the yards and help prevent tell us a little bit more about the pulse product. And then I think we'll wrap up because I don't want to keep you here all day, although I could, it's been a great conversation. It's crazy. I can talk about Carla.
Todd Moore (26m 57s):
Yeah. Interesting topic, but now it's so yeah.
Chris, Safety Dawg (26m 60s):
So with Halston, has he mentioned this
Todd Moore (27m 2s):
Walter's kind of our unique program. It's our cargo loss prevention supply chain security program. So, and how that came about, Chris is ISP global is one of four sister companies or where we're, we're under private ownership by the Dalton group of companies. And most of our sister companies are involved in crisis risk management and crisis response duty of care travel. That's why we have these two crisis response centers and ISB we're kind of in the insurance space.
Todd Moore (27m 34s):
We're kind of in the trucking space. So probably about three years ago, most of the major insurance companies are our clients and our CEO got some feedback saying, look at the loss ratios for Ricardo, or are extremely high. You know, some insurance companies actually even got out of that whole kind of commercial transportation space because of the losses. And they said, is there anything that you guys can put together that could help benefit some type of program? So I came over and kind of developed the program and was kind of focused on preventative measures.
Todd Moore (28m 8s):
So basically what Paltz is, it's, we're kind of an end to end solution one stop shopping. We have a number of different preventative cargo security, preventative products and services that we can offer, you know, site assessments and, and background checks and anything cargo related, interactive, remote video monitoring stuff, kind of our meat and potatoes is our ability to escalate. So what we can do is we can, client has GPS we can integrate, and we can provide that escalation service to the police.
Todd Moore (28m 44s):
We also offer halts GPS kits. So a client comes, we have GPS packages for all modes of transportation. So driver protection, embedded cargo, intermodal, seed containers, ear shipments, all with our pulse escalation. So we we're, we're kind of focused on the Canada and the U S we have escalation abilities in Mexico and in Europe as well. But yeah, it's, it's kind of that. And then solution that we've put together, which is kind of unique.
Todd Moore (29m 17s):
There's some, some companies out there that offer bits and pieces, but we fortunately have the ability to kind of offer end to end solution.
Chris, Safety Dawg (29m 24s):
So the, the club that uses that product or the insurance companies can trucking companies use pieces of that.
Todd Moore (29m 36s):
Well, actually, so it could be, it can be used by trucking companies, manufacturing, insurance companies. We can build packages for the insurance company. So if the insurance company wanted to offer certain packages, whether, Hey, is what GPS kits or escalation or facility security or driver qualification, they can offer those to their, their companies, their, their insurance clients. We, we, we have a lot of manufacturing companies that if you think about manufacturing, PPE, as an example, a lot of them are using third party logistics, right?
Todd Moore (30m 15s):
So they want visibility on their load. So when that load readings, they use embedded cargo devices so they can have visibility. So it's funny free forwarding companies, manufacturing companies that, yeah, definitely it was designed originally for transportation, trucking funds help with risk mitigation. That's cool. I mean,
Chris, Safety Dawg (30m 38s):
Cause I'm not really familiar with pulse as a product. I am familiar with me and me E making eligibility easy. I think that's the correct name, but that's so is, is that part of pulse as well? Is that one of the services?
Todd Moore (30m 53s):
Yeah. So what we've taken, we have led service offerings. So with me, so basically ISP is broken into kind of a three components. We have, we have our insurance division. We have me making eligibility easy, which is a driver qualification and onboarding drivers with abstracts and CVRs and criminal checks. We have employed background screening, which is a big division of ours, which we do all the employee background and criminal checks for rideshare companies and contractors.
Todd Moore (31m 26s):
And then we have pulse with just the cargo cargo component, but me and pulse are very they're integrated. So we offer as part of pulse, we offer some services. That's cool.
Chris, Safety Dawg (31m 38s):
Well, I'd say, I didn't know. ISP had so many different offerings, nevermind that they're a part of a much larger conglomerate. I knew that you were one division, but not quite so large.
Todd Moore (31m 49s):
Her, her companies, the four companies were in Canada, U S Mexico and Brazil and South Africa,
Chris, Safety Dawg (31m 58s):
Because that'd be cool. I want to go there one day.
Todd Moore (32m 0s):
Okay. Can you tell South Africa,
Chris, Safety Dawg (32m 3s):
I guess I got to speak to the president of ISB and see if he can hire me and send me down to South Africa because I don't think I'll be able to afford to go on a vacation there,
Todd Moore (32m 16s):
Chris, Safety Dawg (32m 19s):
Anything else that we need to talk about before we wrap this up?
Todd Moore (32m 23s):
No, you know, something, Chris, that was a great discussion. And like I said, I, I think at the end of the day, it's you come from the insurance world. So, you know, kind of the ripple effect of how deep the problem is for a cargo theft. I come from the police world. So I saw it firsthand. I just, I think we just have to somehow bring awareness to the problem and then kind of work together. Like I said, we, whether it's working in partnership with insurance companies in our programming, and I, I think in the U S they've done a great job.
Todd Moore (32m 59s):
There there's other programs like carbon that are out there that work and in the lease and the insurance companies. And I think if we can replicate that similar type of process in Canada, I think we could start reducing these numbers.
Chris, Safety Dawg (33m 13s):
Yeah. And as you say, it's a lot of it is awareness by the public it's awareness by the politicians, you know, kudos to OTA and CTA. They've tried to raise the, the awareness, I would say unsuccessfully. And the only reason I say that, it wasn't for a lack of trying, we don't see any results.
Todd Moore (33m 38s):
Chris, Safety Dawg (33m 41s):
It is great. So if the carriers who are listening can hurt in their yards, lock the damn trailers, you mentioned that thefts take place mostly on the weekends Friday, the Monday, you said when the police are the busiest doing other stuff.
Todd Moore (33m 58s):
Yeah. And then
Chris, Safety Dawg (34m 1s):
One thing you didn't mention, well, not directly at least background checks of your employees, whether they are working in the warehouse or as a truck driver or as a dispatcher.
Todd Moore (34m 12s):
And that, that's an absolutely great point on Greg brought that up. Chris, if you look, it was funny. We did a survey of what six, seven months ago, and it was funny most trucking companies, but I think it was a hundred percent actually screening her drivers with criminal checks. But if you, if you look at cargo theft, anybody who touches that product along the supply chain security or supply chain should be checked. If you look in warehouses and distribution centers, it was funny. I was at the Texas cargo summit a couple years ago.
Todd Moore (34m 45s):
And one of the speakers there was talking about the corruption within the warehouse. And the majority of it was at the supervisory level where they had their own little crews had access to the manifest, the bill of ladings. And it was pilfered gene. So they were taking half a skid here, half a skip there. And I think it's very important not just to focus on the driver, but anybody who's in that warehouse is touching product. You need to know who's coming in your door and vet those people on.
Todd Moore (35m 16s):
You have to do that. So that's, that's great.
Chris, Safety Dawg (35m 20s):
Sorry. You have to do it. How often,
Todd Moore (35m 23s):
I would say at least annually once a year. You know what I mean? Depending on your turnover rate, if you have a high turnover rate probably twice a year, at least.
Chris, Safety Dawg (35m 33s):
Yeah. And that's something many companies, I don't believe do a, they might do a criminal record background check when they first hire the person. But I don't know of many that revisit that issue.
Todd Moore (35m 46s):
Yeah. And the reason I say that to Chris is in the world of policing, we used to grow up and we used to recruit people that we felt could be valuable to a police investigation and organized crime has the exact same thing. They, they recruit people, trucking companies, whether it be dispatchers supervisors, people that have access to information, right. And now, unfortunately, some people can fall on the wrong side of the coin. They maybe I'm, I'm, I'm into gambling.
Todd Moore (36m 16s):
And I have a gambling debt of my dad. I have to pay this off and provide information, or maybe I have a substance abuse issue. And so I think it's important to make sure no who's working in your facility. And, and not another thing we have to as part of our pulse program is we have a Colonel theft tip line, and that was designed almost like a Crimestoppers tip line. And I'm thinking if you had a loss within your organization, you put it out 99% of your, your employees are good people, but having the ability and having your employees, having a vehicle that they can anonymously report information, I think you're going to get decent information back.
Todd Moore (36m 56s):
Right. And, you know, we all know what we've all worked with. People that might be shady, you know, they're shady. So I think if you give them that vehicle, but the ability to report that information that can help too. So that was another thing we, as well as kind of that ability to internal hotline.
Chris, Safety Dawg (37m 16s):
So I didn't didn't even know about that. So will is, is out available for all trucking companies to use. So it is part of our
Todd Moore (37m 26s):
Bolts, escalation, what you get. We get the 24 hour 24 seven monitoring of the cargo alerts, the escalation to the police, you all. We also get a 24 seven cargo theft tip line. That's manned by our monitoring center. And you also get the, all their drivers get online truck hijack, all part of the pulse escalation package.
Chris, Safety Dawg (37m 50s):
It's cool. Cause I got taught. I think that's a great way to end it. Thanks so much for being on the doggone trucking podcast. I appreciate your time.
Todd Moore (37m 59s):
Thanks so much, Chris. Thanks for having me and stay safe.
Chris, Safety Dawg (38m 5s):
Hope you love the show. As much as I did, please leave us a, like a thumbs up a review, a comment, a rating. If it is, thank you so much. And I do really appreciate your time and join us again next week for another exciting.